Ship Discourse - Blog Posts
I find it interesting that antis will immediately assume you touch kids irl when they see you liking fucked up things in ships or fics like big age gap
I think it shows how they collectively see ships as something to project themselves into ONLY and therefore they gladly call anyone who sees ships' appeal differently big words like "pedo" & "groomer"
Just because their only ships understanding is "me and who" and no other understandings have crossed their minds yet
Reblogging again because I'd like more people to see this
One of my friends who is an anti and a comshipper in denial (human x non-human, dubcon/noncon, angst enjoyer) told me recently that liking non-con and abuse in fiction is okay but enjoying kodocon and incest in the same fiction is not
And I was wondering... Why are these two things (which are BOTH morally wrong irl and are BOTH illegal or harmful irl, which BOTH can be triggering to someone and BOTH can be pretty much enjoyable to someone in fiction) treated differently? Why are those aspects of dark fiction treated so... Well... Twofold?
Abuse, guro, eroguro, murders (and any brutal crimes in general), kodocon, pedo/zoo/necrophilia, non/dubcon, severe mental illnesses etc description falls under darkfic definition, as far as I can tell, and antis tend to enjoy some parts of it (the greatest example of it is YanSim, Danganronpa and some psychological horrors enjoyers) with no shame, but at the same time they shame comship/kodocon/noncon enjoyers for the same thing. Isn't that weird?
My theory is, they treat these things differently because these things mostly present romantic or sexual stuff and so are pretty easy to be romanticized and sexualized. But:
Not every dark romantic or sexual fiction is meant to be seen as romantic/sexual in general and is meant to be romanticized or sexualized. From my experience, I would say it works vice versa. Romantic or sexual fiction can be used as a vent, as a representation of sexual traumatic experience, as an intentionally disturbing and triggering media (for horrors and thrillers), as an appeal to reflection of the essence of romantic/sexual relationships and behaviors between humans etc
Everything, in fact, can be romanticized or sexualized, no matter of its content. People romantize and sexualize mental illnesses, neurodiversions, murders, self-harm, suicide, cannibalism etc — everything that is NOT sexual or romantic in the first place. That's why, for example, different fetishes and eroguro exist
Romanticizing and sexualizing something in fiction and in real life is really different. Yes, in some cases fiction CAN affect reality and vice versa (for example how drawn porn can make you have certain fetishes, even though the porn you consumed were not, in fact, real), but it's NOT as common as antis and pro-cencorship people think. The only reasons (from what I know) people think fiction reflects real life unspoken rules are that they are either not mature enough to separate fiction from reality or their perception of reality is way too disrupted. So, if you're not a teenager/adult or if you know fiction can affect the way you treat real people, do not consume the fiction that you think can alter your brain into thinking dark fiction presents what's right and what's wrong, what you can do and can't do. And if you're a parent, please, watch your children and control the stuff they consume till they're mature enough. That's it
Also I would like to mention that it's OKAY to dislike, hate or despise dark fiction, or even people that consume this kind of stuff, as long as you don't assault, insult, or try to make real human beings feel bad about themselves in any way
That's all I wanted to say for today. Enjoy whatever you like and be happy. Have a good day!! <3
It's kinda performative activism as well. They're able to sit back and call others freaks, weirdos and disgusting for enjoying incest in fiction and feel like they're contributing to positive change in the world.
I'll say it once more, you're absolutely allowed to not like blmatsu and be repulsed by it, you have every right to your preferences. But thought crimes are not a real thing. Writing and drawing spicy blmatsu work isn't equivalent to wanting to bang your irl relatives and officiating sibling weddings on the weekend. You're no better or worst of a person for not liking blmatsu. You're just a person with your own preferences, just like blmatsu shippers.
I find the difference in mentality between jap and eng fandom interesting. While americans forbid even the mention of blmatsu, the japanese freely joke about it. Both behaviors have some sort of cultural connotation. This is a good topic for me to ponder
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Hey osomatsu san fandom 👍🏻
Some of y'all are chill but there seems to be a fuck load of people here that're like this. Do better. Don't wish death upon strangers for shipping incestous relationships of fictional brothers that exist only in an anime. you can dislike blmatsu all you want, that perfectly fine and everyone is entitled to their own preferences and opinions. Let's just remember to treat each like people, please?
I find that People who are incapable of separating fiction from reality are more dangerous than people who draw fucked up or horrifying stuff im not even kidding.
Because someone drawing incest porn does not wish death on others for not liking their freak but I've seen it from anti shippers and the "protect little kids" group time and again.
Genuinely it is horrifying to see grown ups or 20+ year olds piling onto a twt or post and telling someone to off themselves over a few drawings or a fic.
Congratulations to timebomb for being one of the few straight ships that i've seen being treated the same as queer ships (at least in any other space than tumblr)
"They're sibling coded" check
"They are/were enemies!" check
"I just can't see either of them in a relationship" check
"Well [insert other ship] is better" check
"They don't like each other!" check
"You are normalizing toxic couples!" check
This is not even complaining i just find it funny because i've rarely seen a straight ship being hated on that way, it's simply funny. Though it has been mostly on tiktok and we all know how the ship discourse can get there.
Look, I've read the Hannibal novels as well but can book fans please stop purposefully finding posts by the series fans to derail it and stuff? Like, we get it, the books and the series have different "endgame" ships but.. the term "ship and let ship" exists for a damn reason. And I know that it sucks, the way different aspects of Clarice's character gets split to multiple characters, but A) it was because of copyright issues, and B) you should've directed the anger at the producer instead of the fandom. Also why tf do you guys want to harass the shippers of a mlm ship so bad it's starting to feel a bit iffy.
That actually gives me some better context thank you! Honestly I do think it’s down to perspective and people’s personal favorite tropes versus tropes they don’t like. Like what you’re willing to put up with in the media you consume and for everyone it’s different.
Like I’ll be honest, I think Akechi is one of the best written characters in the game. However I also don’t really like his kind of characters. And that’s okie I recognize he just isn’t really a character I enjoy that much it’s down to personal taste.
And I think it’s the same with shuake/akeshu. It’s down to what you enjoy and I personally like clear cut and wholesome ships more than the complicated not so clear ones. Honestly my biggest confusion with the ship really is just how Futaba and Haru would feel about it. But I guess that’s the point, the relationship is complicated. I just sometimes wish there was some more emphasis on it to highlight how that is inherently a bit of a problem (like I feel like most people wouldn’t want to be friends with someone who is dating someone that really hurt them, even if it wasn’t intended).
No hard feelings though thanks! Your post did give me some better insight! I am getting it a little better now haha
I don’t get akeshu / shuake at all.
Like I get it from a typical “fandom loves the enemies to lovers trope” perspective but in all honesty I don’t get the insane brainrot the persona 5 fandom has for this ship.
Like do I think Joker cares for Akechi? Yes.
Do I think he was genuinely conflicted/tempted by Maruki’s ultimatum? Yes.
Do I think they have a genuine relationship and see a lot of themselves in each other and actually somewhat understand each other? Yes.
That being said, I really don’t see how anyone can look past the fact that Akechi tried to kill Joker. And okie fine enemies to lovers, fandom’s favorite ship aside, I don’t see how Joker can actually want a full on relationship (like romantic) with this dude when Futaba, Sojiro, and Haru are like right there?
This may just be me but I reallllllllly wouldn’t be friends with someone who is friends (hell forget even in a romantic relationship) with someone who horribly hurt me.
And I don’t think Joker loves Akechi more than Futaba, Sojiro, or Haru. Especially Sojiro and Futaba. Those two are like his family, and Akechi is responsible for their suffering.
Like… it’s kind of one or the other. Joker can’t be friends/dating Akechi without horribly betraying Futaba, Sojiro, and Haru. That’s just how I see it (but I’m open to hearing other perspectives!)
I don’t get akeshu / shuake at all.
Like I get it from a typical “fandom loves the enemies to lovers trope” perspective but in all honesty I don’t get the insane brainrot the persona 5 fandom has for this ship.
Like do I think Joker cares for Akechi? Yes.
Do I think he was genuinely conflicted/tempted by Maruki’s ultimatum? Yes.
Do I think they have a genuine relationship and see a lot of themselves in each other and actually somewhat understand each other? Yes.
That being said, I really don’t see how anyone can look past the fact that Akechi tried to kill Joker. And okie fine enemies to lovers, fandom’s favorite ship aside, I don’t see how Joker can actually want a full on relationship (like romantic) with this dude when Futaba, Sojiro, and Haru are like right there?
This may just be me but I reallllllllly wouldn’t be friends with someone who is friends (hell forget even in a romantic relationship) with someone who horribly hurt me.
And I don’t think Joker loves Akechi more than Futaba, Sojiro, or Haru. Especially Sojiro and Futaba. Those two are like his family, and Akechi is responsible for their suffering.
Like… it’s kind of one or the other. Joker can’t be friends/dating Akechi without horribly betraying Futaba, Sojiro, and Haru. That’s just how I see it (but I’m open to hearing other perspectives!)